Depending on the nature of your work, planning for remote work work and/or flex hours after your procedure could help your recovery AND help your bosses. Guy talks about church activities Fine. They had everything set up in advance because, when you get that call, its NOW. Pretty wild that this group couldnt stop yammering about their religion for one day (or week, same thing) when they knew their manager was visiting. They know the estimated timeline, and it IS during the busy season, so theres no harm in sharing that so their manager can make contingency plans. :\. Not sick! Instead, perhaps we should exercise a respectful curiosity, and attempt to learn a little bit about our work colleagues' religious . They were also incredibly accepting of other peoples beliefs, including our other non-religious and often over-sharing cube mate. (There were a number of people with the same job title but different areas of responsibility so I had to quickly show someone some of the basic differences so they could cover the urgent stuff that I couldnt do in advance). Its a losing game to explain boundaries to those who push back; they need to be given as little as possible to argue with. But OP would be opening up their colleagues to it too. He asked if he could take that day off anyway and they didnt seem to care. That being said, mazel tov on your upcoming procedure! I like your last option which is pretty honest. Thanks for your message! I then did basically what yall said to do: laid out that its a potentially long wait list, but my projected dates are sometime between sept-nov, and that its usually a minimum of a week of recovery, but that its highly variable, and I wont know how long Ill need for sure until Ive had the surgery. Even though this is something hugely important and personal for you (and good luck for it when you get the date! Dont lift/carry more than 5 lbs Anyone who needs help saying "I'm not comfortable talking about religion" can get help from Faith in HR or from me. If youre required to have one day banked that you cant use, its not really in the bank, is it? If someone wants to wear a crucifix necklace or have crosses or whatever sort of Jesus paraphernalia in their cubicle, fine. The majority of the time they would call in sick the day after their flight. #2 All our best employees keep leaving for other companies!. Does this have a disparate impact on parents and especially mothers? What a bunch of b*stards . They should therefor be able to take all 12 sick days without anyone taking any notice or issue or counting up how many days theyve been sick each year. Thats horrible. Speaking from personal experience and from knowing others who had the same surgery, one week post-op will still leave you pretty down for the count. I would say its more like if the company offers an allowance to pay for work clothes, and you use it to buy clothes you dont intend to wear for work because you already have enough work clothes. But between now and August Im just worried and miserable :-/. How to deal with coworkers who constantly talk about religion - Quora " cdrMEJ0LT0 dr l? But Ill never know for sure, and it means that when I say to mutual friends, Hey, so I dont actually want to do this group thing with ____ because I still feel hurt that shes ended our friendship, they tell me Im probably imagining it and being oversensitive. That parenthetical. If its still not resolved, then you can go to your own manager and say, Hey, I find these long, off-topic conversations really distracting. Sure, the friendship predates the company, but that is nuance and nuance is tricky with folks like HRina. I would speak up every time I hear it. ), its not really something major for a company. #3 Im sorry for not being more straightforward earlier; I didnt feel comfortable directly saying no when I was newer to the company, but the truth is that I like to keep certain boundaries between my work and personal life in general, and kayaking is one of those activities I use to get completely away from work.. Is family status a protected class in my state? If I was told September and know that realistically it might very well be August, October, or November, Ill be careful not to set the expectation that Ill likely be out in September even if thats the expectation the NHS/hospital /doctor set with me. Whereas if you got a nasty bug and were out sick then you failed perfect attendance. Youre right- I was talking about the situation in JOs comment and not OP2, but I didnt specify that in my comment. I think the your freedom to swing your fist ends at my nose rule is generally a pretty good guideline. On the one hand: what did she think would happen? Not suspicious to me at all. There was also a man diving for lobsters who was in a whales mouth. #1 how can I get my coworker to stop talking about God? Yeah, its hugely variable. Countess Boochie Flagrante*. Your faith is part of your personality and so are many other elements like your likes and dislikes, your life outside of work and your unique point of view. But its more likely that someone uses all their sick time because they are sick. In either case, someone could say I need to leave work early for a family event or an appointment without mentioning any religion. I agree. Save it for the 1-2-1 and have a brief conversation about it. She never called in sick on the 1st or 5th working day , because she never had any sick time until she come to work that 7th day. The issue was solved when their manager, who was in an office in another state, came for a visit, saw alllll the chatter that was going on and compared that with the amount of work that was getting done and laid off all but one person in the group. I have a medical thing coming up that will require a couple of weeks of recovery. If not, you need to do that first. If youre paddling open ocean or large lakes (like the Great Lakes in the US), in more advanced conditions (cold water, wind/waves), or paddling whitewater, then the risk profile changes and you would want to have a conversation with any co paddlers. and if thats the case, and LW1s management or HR is spineless.well, thats a crappy situation indeed. I probably COULD have started working from home the same week I had surgery, but I definitely shouldnt have, so if youre able to take a full week, you should do that. you have to put your leave request in X number of days before an absence of Y length) while sick leave is more often unplanned and you can just call out the morning of because thats how being sick often works. That only works if you actually ALLOW people to take sick leave and dont make all sorts of ridiculous policies. Its cool to see them but theyre out there trying to survive, and we should respect that. If employees are using all of their sick days when they have health issues (eg migraine) that they might otherwise have felt compelled to work through were a different policy in place, that is an extremely appropriate and healthy use of sick leave, not gaming the system! yeah, hopefully lw1 can get it shut down through (hopefully) accommodating management/hr or (if necessary) pointing out religious harassment but its not a stretch to think that the antagonist in this take might be skirting the boundaries of the law without blatantly crossing it. So I dont think op saying why they left is a good idea on that front either. Were all aware how stretched the NHS is at the moment, so Im sure your manager will understand the situation and be grateful that they have the heads up so that they can try and put some contingencies in place while you recover. If hes insulting other religions or implying people outside his religion are going to hell, yes. And incredible story. #2 Is your company big enough that Glassdoor posts would be effectively anonymous? updates: coworker prayed Ill return to Jesus, the awful corporate jargon, and more. Seriously. LW continuously delaying might eventually turn the director off as well. How do you handle it? It is part of who I am. Does their leave get cancelled? I sat down with her and explained that as thoughtful as she was to offer to help her colleagues find their way to religion, her overtures were also unwelcome by most of our team. Which made me doubt the evidence, or at least the way its applied. Any Office Space reference is a day-brightener. If hes talking to other people about religion and they welcome the conversation but the LW doesnt want to have to constantly be working in the presence of that, its hazier (and so in that case, hopefully one of the other categories of more clearly not okay would apply). 1. If your co-worker cant contain their conversation about their religion to their actions (My weekend? 2. I got the phone call at that time. I assumed that was just the idiom of his day, but maybe not. To LW #4: I recently supported one of the folks on my team (Im the manager) as they navigated the uncertain scheduling of their own top surgery, which did end up falling on one of the busiest weeks of our year (and then they were out for 8 weeks for recovery). TBC, I am 100% aligned with LW1 on this being inappropriate and frustrating (and why I wouldnt discuss religion at work, were I more religious). Many politicians start their mornings by saying a prayer or two. You're not going to write a policy, but you need a way to communicate with your employees (other than one-on-one, which would take ages!) What I did was talk to my boss and explain the situation. She was surprised to hear it, but she understood and the invitations stopped. OP4 mentions NHS. No need to pretend OP isnt going to kayak this summer, just that they are too busy to kayak with HR. Or even better, just say that you want to keep work separate from the rest of your life and want to draw a hard boundary between them. What is the role of faith at Angry Chocolates? Theyre just strongly discouraging you and penalizing you if you do. The person determines they cant be at work for any reason, you determine your business can afford to have this person out a certain days per year. Yes, I thought it was clear that I was suggesting this as a last resort. But then youre both at risk of legal action, on the behalf the third party. The real answer is that I would probably just be to talk to her in a friendly but straightforward way, or ask the group to take their meeting to a conference room (instead of you going in there). its that being sick the exact same number of days every year and that amount equating exactly to the amount of days they get paid for is a bit unlikely. . If this company wants to give less sick leave, then they should give less sick leave, not assume that people who use the allowed are misusing it. Prospective employees should know, and who knows, it might get attention elsewhere in the company that big boss is gaming the unused sick bonus. As long as he was doing his work and he wasnt bothering his coworkers, I let him rant for a minute every so often. One of only two people at my company with a niche technical skill set that is absolutely required for our major fall product launch to be successful, so Ive really been stressing for months now about what happens with my team. I dont know when itll be, but hopefully within the next 12 months!. And if the lawyer says that this isnt ok, then the words contractual obligation can work wonders to get people to change course. Yes, tying sick leave usage to a performance bonus for the boss implies that the boss has significant power to influence how many sick days people take, which is either not true, or not good if it is true. Coworker talks about his religion all the time. I like this framing in terms of wait list it makes clear that the vagueness is on the hospital side, not yours. Im glad speaking up works for you, but for a lot of people with trauma from growing up in high-control environments, arguing about it is retraumatizing. It would presumably not be legal to hire you at $80k/year and then only pay you $70k/year, so how is the company allowed to veto your time off like that? If I have use them or lose them sick days? Copyright 2007 - 2023 Ask A Manager. If he cant enjoy bragging about his religion, he may stop. My vote is for giving your manager a non-time specific notice so she can make a plan. Blanket targets are harmful and no substitute for good management. conversations - How to address a double standard where my religious
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